Her Coast FIRE Plan Has Some MAJOR Holes: Finding Balance Between FIRE and Burnout

Introduction: From 60% to 8% Savings Rate (0:00)

Bo: So far we’ve seen you operating in two realms. Yeah. $3,750 maximum capacity or now—I mean if you do—you do $9,000 into $110,000—that’s an 8% savings rate. So going from killing the savings rate like 30%–40% to 8%—it seems just as a casual bystander—there might be some middle ground that might be more sustainable and more fruitful over the long term.

Career Background: Sign Language Interpreter (0:27)

Bo: What is it you do professionally?

Danielle: I’m a sign language interpreter. So I do a lot of the business, corporate. It is actually mostly federal government more than private business because I—you know—it’s the DMV—the DC, Maryland, Virginia area. So all of the federal agencies are right there. And they hire a lot of deaf people and they have interpreters all day every day. I do a lot of work for one agency. It’s—you know—8 hours of work. I have an hourly rate. So I do a lot of that. I do some medical and then some other just random.

Bo: Are you employed by the agency or you like a contractor?

Danielle: I’m self-employed. So when I say agency, I mean like the federal agency, but there are interpreting agencies. When you are an interpreter, you just reach out to them and say, “Hey, I’m an interpreter.” They either just—yeah, we’ll add you to our list to get emails with work—or here’s the portal to sign into to look for work. Or they want to screen you and they record you interpreting to make sure you’re good enough. I probably get like 200 emails a day of just work.

Brian: Oh wow—available work. This is—because I remember—I realized in my own journey I was a finance major and I was like—man after I took my first class and I was like—there’s not going to be a job in this because it’s too easy. Everybody can do this. That’s why I switched to accounting because you’re pretty much guaranteed a job. Is this just a hack, a job hack? If you have the skill set to do this, there is more demand than there are people who can do this skill.

Danielle: I do think it’s a very niche field, so not a lot of people get into it compared to your accountants or teachers or nurses. The language—it was only actually recognized as a true language in the ’60s. So it’s almost still evolving in a sense. So it’s not I think as easy as Spanish interpreting because that I feel like that’s pretty—you know—the word for dog is the word for dog. But in ASL there’s so many different ways to sign a sentence and each person might sign it differently. You have—one sign can have five different meanings. So you have to use context to know which meaning you’re going to pick. And all that is happening within seconds of just pure brain processing.

Certification and Accountability (2:42)

Bo: Is there a degree or certification—how do—so you have an accounting degree right? Did you have to get another degree or a separate certification to be able to do this?

Danielle: So I didn’t. As far as the degree they have changed. There’s the Registry of Interpreters for the Deaf—RID—and they hold the—they sponsor the national certification. So they’ve had a new rule change I think 5 years ago where you have to have a bachelor’s degree but it can be in anything that you want. Okay. I had the bachelor’s in accounting. I actually have an associate’s in business administration too because I did the community college and then transfer into the public school.

Brian: Financial mutant style. I love that. I want to get into the financial stuff because you have some goals and we want to cover that, but I did have one more question. Is there any type of accountability or auditing of interpreters so that they can ensure you’re not doing Run-DMC lyrics to Tricky instead of actually doing—and obviously when you’re working one-on-one as the interpreter—if the communication doesn’t work—but in other things—is there any type of auditing or accountability or is that just everyone has their own flavor and flair. So there’s not—you said something very interesting there where there’s five different ways to say this. How does that work? And then I promise we’ll get right on track but I just—out of curiosity.

Danielle: A lot of people have a lot of questions when I mention-

Brian: No, you have a cool unique job and then I assumed when I was doing prep for the show today I was like—we’re going to find out there’s some intersection point with a family story or a loved one or something because it’s just—how do you land in this and then to find out—you didn’t have—you going through an accounting program here. So it’s interesting to me. Is there any accountability—how do they make sure that people are doing good work? Like when I’m at tech or other things watching these interpreters, how do they know if somebody’s doing good work?

Danielle: Yeah. So the deaf people is one because there is something—it’s called DNS—do not send. So if I interpret for a deaf person and they didn’t like me, they didn’t like how I signed, I wasn’t getting them—there’s deaf people that are engineers, I’m not good enough to do that type of thing. They can tell the agency, “Hey don’t send that interpreter.” So nothing happens to me. I just can’t work with that person. Yeah. Potentially if they’re the only deaf person in that business then I just mean I can’t work there anymore. But I mean deaf people can sue you just like a doctor or if you’re really that—I have liability insurance and I think there’s complaints that can be made—our certification can get taken away and stuff like that. So we put ourselves in positions that we know we’ll do okay. I live right by Johns Hopkins University, so there’s a lot of sciency stuff that goes on over there with work and it would be great because it’s 15 minutes from my house. But I wouldn’t touch that.

Bo: Not your jam on the sciency stuff.

Danielle: You can understand. I just started dipping my toe in legal. Okay. Because that’s a little scary, but I’m just doing jury duty right now, so it’s not too bad.

Bo: It’s wild. Even inside this very niche industry, you can even develop niches inside the niche, right? You can be the science person or the legal person. Yeah. Fascinating.

Financial Snapshot: $181K Net Worth at 33 (5:49)

Danielle: And the reason, just to point out with the money aspect, I don’t think you can make this kind of money anywhere else in the country.

Brian: Oh—so this is—you think you’re unique. You’re the unicorn. You live in the right intersection place of where the need is and your skill set matches.

Bo: Well, and let’s catch everyone else up, right? Because you were so kind. You shared a net worth statement. And did you say how old you were yet? How old are you?

Danielle: I’m 33.

Bo: 33 years old. And it’s remarkable as we sit here today, you have a total net worth of about $181,000. And when we look at the shovel, the income that you make doing this very niche position that you said you found—what was the word you used? Oh no, she used an SAT word. So there’s no way I’m repeating that. Circuitous. Circuitous—whatever. It was wild. And here you are. You make over $115,000 to $120,000 a year doing this. At age 33, that is awesome. For what we know so far, it looks like you’re in a fantastic financial position. Would you agree with that assessment? Do you feel like you’re in a wonderful spot?

Danielle: I do. Sometimes I don’t though. I feel like even making that—I mean $120,000 is definitely—I have to work a lot—weekends, overnights to make that—that much. So if it’s a little closer to the $110,000 area, I do feel a little bit of the financial squeeze these days with just cost of living going up. Yeah. I’m glad I started investing because I had a lot of—I really didn’t start until 2021. I had maybe $5,000.

Bo: So you did all this. You built $165,000 of investments since 2021. Yeah. That’s awesome.

Danielle: Because it was—I mean COVID obviously was terrible but COVID had me working from home. You can—you do video interpreting just on Teams or Zoom. And I couldn’t really spend my money on anything because nothing was happening. Yeah. Yeah. I like to go out to restaurants and travel—you know—big things that I spend my money on, but nothing was happening. So I was putting aside—investing over $30,000 a year. And then I think the stock market probably helped a little bit just with—

Brian: I was trying to figure out this morning when I was looking at this, you already seem pretty disciplined. I know you said you spend—going out, but when we looked at the—the budget numbers, you’re not—you’re not crazy on—I mean you’re making $9,000 to $10,000 a month gross. You don’t—you spend less than $4,000 a month?

Tax Situation and Savings Strategy (8:22)

Brian: What’s your take-home? Because I mean, I’m sure you’re—since you’re self-employed, you have to reserve some money for taxes and other things. So what do you—what do you typically think your budget is—coming in each month?

Danielle: I set aside a lot in taxes. So it’s usually 36% is put aside for taxes because you have FICA—or Social Security and Medicare—and then you’ve also got the income tax. That’sactually reasonable—the self-employment tax because you pay the employer and the employee side. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, it’s a lot because I’m just a sole proprietorship.

Bo: And so what’s your savings look like as you—I mean obviously if you’ve spent four years saving and you have $165,000. Walk us through how you think about saving on a monthly basis. Where’s your money going that you’re not spending or not putting into taxes?

Danielle: So I usually have goals for the month. I think I set it to look at the beginning of the year in January. I’ll be like—okay what’s—going on this year? You know—what do I think I could reasonably do? So I kind of set a goal with investments and—cash as well, how much I want to set aside in cash and how much to invest. So during COVID it was a lot more.

The Dramatic Savings Shift (9:27)

Bo: Let’s talk about now. What are your goals right now in terms of saving?

Danielle: I’ve backed down a lot just because I think I’ve gotten past that point of where you’re doing a lot of cash and not getting a lot of the interest yet. So right now it’s—$750 to investing. It used to be $3,000 a month I was doing and then about $600 to cash. I’m not doing that right now. I had my first year of all the adult things happening to you, you know, I needed new tires on my car. I did that and then a week later something skidded out skidded out on the road and just destroyed two of my tires again. And then there’s health stuff insurance wouldn’t cover. That was a few thousand dollars. And then my dog is really old, so there’s that stuff. It all just happened this year. So I need to build back my emergency fund. And then I will need a new car probably soon. My car is 10 years old and has 160,000 miles on it, I think. I really want to have a good—I think you guys say 20%. I think I’m shooting for maybe 30%. Okay.

Bo: You said how many miles does it have?

Danielle: 160,000.

Bo: When you buy new cars, what kind of cars do you buy? What’s the price? So what price point that you’re going to spend on a car, do you think?

Danielle: A used car. I’ve just been looking. I think I’m just going to get the same car I have now, just newer, because I’m not really into cars and it’s reliable. So used ones that are 2 years old with 30,000 miles, so I can have it for a long time. It looks like $28,000. Yeah. So I’m aiming for $10,000 saved, which is a little closer to 30%. I think $9,000, I guess, is 30%.

Emergency Fund Discussion (11:08)

Brian: What’s your emergency reserve would you like to—to have? I know you said you’re a little short right now. What do you think your emergency reserves need to be?

Danielle: They’re actually back up to what I had them at. It was usually $10,000. But then I was watching your show a lot more and I was going to say, “How’d you come up with $10,000?” Seemed like maybe that’s enough. I actually used to be more cash heavy and my dad was like, “You shouldn’t be that cash heavy.” You’re single, you’re young, you don’t have anything to worry about. Listening to your show, I was like, “Maybe I should have closer to the $15,000 mark.”

Bo: And what’s your—from a spending standpoint to pay rent, utility, gas, all that kind of stuff? How much do you spend a month?

Danielle: You mean without the optional stuff? If I lost my job and I’m not going to go out to eat. That’s right.

Bo: What would that burn rate be?

Danielle: Probably closer to the $2,800 to $3,000. I have a lot of insurance stuff that being self-employed I have to pay for.

Bo: Well, so if we’re thinking through, okay, if your monthly burn rate is $3,000, you’re a single individual, single income coming in, I would say that six months of living expenses is probably appropriate. So for you, I would think it’d be somewhere around that $18,000 would be the goal that I would shoot for.

Brian: But I’m going to pick on Danielle a little bit in the fact that you did what people always do to me when I say, “What is your spend rate?” They always give me the bare bones of what? And you said three, but we know what you submitted to kind of the producers and we have this up on the screen. If you really take into account because we all have subscriptions now. Yeah, you could gut it. Yeah, you—we all eat out a little bit. We all have miscellaneous stuff. You’re actually closer to $4,000 probably. So that’s why I think Bo, you’re spot on. And I’m not picking on you too hard because $18,000 to $24,000 is probably your sweet spot. We’re probably in a minute, we’ll talk about because you have goals of this car that will kind of need to be a sinking fund thing that will kind of expand out this emergency reserves a little bit. We just have to figure out how we integrate that with other goals that you have because we haven’t gotten into the—what are you saving for? Yeah.

Coast FIRE Goals and Die with Zero (13:02)

Bo: What are your goals? What’s the reason? What’s the purpose for us sitting down here today?

Danielle: So I think I am trying to do a not very traditional route, you know, where you work for 40 years and then you retire and whatnot.

Bo: I guess what do you want to do?

Danielle: I want to do kind of… I’m sure you’re familiar with Coast FIRE, but it’s—

Brian: Sorry, I never heard of that. What’s that?

Danielle: But it’s not exactly Coast FIRE either, because I do think I want to invest throughout the life of the market instead of just stopping at—you know—I could maybe stop at 40 or something and then just never invest again. I would like to keep investing just to get the full market, but I also—I don’t—I don’t plan on having kids and I think that makes a little bit of a difference. So I’ve kind of added in—there’s a book called Die with Zero, and it’s this concept of—a lot of times when people die, they’re actually left with more money than what they started with. And I just don’t feel the need to do that. If I don’t have—if I had kids, it’d be a very different story. But I don’t plan—I have some nieces and nephew, my brother has three, but they’re both engineers, you know, they’ll be set up. Sure. So yeah, I think I would just rather spend more time when I’m younger—just not having to work as much.

Defining the Timeline (14:23)

Brian: I want to—because I want to come back to a few things you just said, but I do need to know some basics because you’ve given us a lot there. When do you think you want to—kind of—you said you want to keep saving, investing, but when do you think you want to at least have the option of that you don’t have to work anymore? What’s the age on that?

Danielle: Well, I guess full retirement is about 60. It’s not—because—but I think what I want to do is work less because I’m self-employed. Yeah.

Brian: But with coast, you want to be able to kind of control what—how you’re using your time to a degree. So there’s an age that you’d like—behind you to be big enough that you get options.

Danielle: I would say by 37 to 40 I would like to-

Brian: Which is it? 37 or 40? Look this is important stuff because there’s a big difference between a 35-year-old and a 40-year-old when you’re doing FIRE/FINE type things.

Danielle: I’ll say 37 to at least be able to have one day—every single week I’m only working a 4-day week and then maybe 10 years later I can just do three days a week and ride that out until I fully retire.

Understanding the Coast FIRE Approach (15:31)

Bo: Because I don’t understand the language—you’re talking about Coast FIRE and then you would like to work—you said you’re 33 right now—you’d like to work at your current pace and capacity for the next four years and then have the freedom and ability to back down a day—basically cut down your workload from four days down to three days—well 5 days down to 4 days I’m sorry—5 days down to 4 days—and but still going to save and build so it’s not like at 37 you want to be financially independent—you—you want to put your—put the foot on the gas as much as you can between now and 37. So that 37 you can potentially take the foot off the gas a little bit. Am I describing that correctly?

Brian: But you still want to save—even—see so maybe instead of saving 20%–25% you’d like to save 10% or something like that.

Danielle: So this was the first year I kind of implemented that. I’m investing $750 a month which is—you know—$9,000 a year and that’s way less than what I had been doing. So I kind of want to do that for the rest of my time—just add $9,000 a year until I fully retire. And then—

Bo: Okay. So walk me through the—I want to understand the mindset there, right? I have this desire that four years from now, I want to be able to take my foot off the gas. But it sounds like what you just said is you’ve already taken your foot off the gas. You went from investing $3,000 a month to $750 a month. And yeah, it sounds like you’re already—I’m—I’m using—I’m going to use the word coast, but when we’re going to call this financial mutant FINE, you’re already financial mutant FINEing, but that’s not a future day. You’ve already made the decision to do that today. Walk us through that. Normally, people say, “Hey, I need to get to this threshold first and then I can back down.” But you’ve already backed down.

Danielle: I think the biggest thing is I’m probably going to need to reduce my living expenses a little bit in order to do it. I’d say the reason I backed down—one, I was a little burned out if I’m being totally honest. And if I kind of look at my numbers, I think I—I sent you guys a spreadsheet I was kind of using to figure all this out. And when I plug in $9,000 starting this year at 7% and doing $9,000 until I’m 60, I think it put me at $1.7 million and that’s at the 7%. And then because it’s that Die with Zero mentality, I’m definitely going to be withdrawing more than 4%. So I will be technically losing money every year. And then I think it—I had it out to age 90 and I would still have $300,000 to $400,000 left. But in those last two years, my withdrawal rate is 20%. You know, because my nest egg has decreased.

The Marathon Runner Analogy (18:04)

Bo: And so you’re going to die at 90. I just want to make sure. Okay. Because Die with Zero is a wonderful concept if you know when your exit is, right? The unfortunate part is none of us really know a lot about when our exit is and we don’t know exactly all the variables between now and whenever that exit does exist and what lifestyle and expenses would—and so one of the things that—I’m just going to be honest that makes me a little bit nervous is you’re young which is a wonderful wonderful thing but you are making some decisions—hey I projected this out and if I do this and everything works this way then this is what the outcome’s going to be—but that’s pretty early on and this is the analogy I always said—I’m—I’m not a big runner—But I have some friends that are runners. When they set out to go run a half marathon or a marathon, it’s a very, very long race. Yeah. If you come out of the gate and you say, “Man, I’m running a 6-minute mile pace. I’m blazing.” That does not mean that when you finish that race that your pace will have been 6 minutes. You know what I mean? Just because you start that way. And just because you say, “Oh, well, I’ve done this for the last mile. Surely the next 25 miles I’m going to be able to—you know—match that.” Exactly. That’s one of the reasons why we understand—because of the wealth multiplier, because of the way compounding interest works, the more that you can get in early, the more powerful it can be. We love the idea of taking your foot off the gas and backing down and doing that. But once you’ve reached the threshold, that makes sense to do that. What I’m curious about is, have you actually reached the threshold where it makes sense to do that just yet?

Running the Numbers (19:44)

Brian: Can I give some color to this? Now, you gave—because you gave me a very valuable piece of nugget of information that I don’t know if it works for your situation, but at least lets me make an example or give you some perspective or context. You said that you’ve done some quick math and projections and $1.7 million when you’re 60, right? So I said, “Well, okay, $1.7 million, let’s bring that back to today’s dollars, the purchasing power of today.” And I just use 3%. Who knows what inflation’s going to be? You know, we’ve had some years where it’s—stretches where it’s 2%. We just came through a stretch where it was as high as 7%, but I used 3%. That $1.7 million brought back into today’s dollars is $757,000. So then I applied the 4% withdrawal rate to that. That’s $30,000 a year. You divide that by 12. You are setting yourself up to basically live off of in today’s dollars $2,500 a month. Now, you said you only spend $3,000, so maybe that’s okay. But I know when we actually looked at your real budget where you actually get to go eat out, you know, have subscriptions so you can watch stuff and other things, it was closer to $4,000. There’s a thing I have learned as I’ve gotten older. And I’m going to give you some thoughts on Die with Zero. I—I actually like the book and the concept, but there’s some assumptions that go into it, and that’s what Bo was alluding to because you have three phases of your life. There’s the make wealth phase. There’s the maintain wealth phase. And then there’s the multiply where you get to say, “Hey, money’s not a thing. I want to go enrich people. I want to go share, you know, what all these resources I have.” The author who wrote Die with Zero—if you go look at his trajectory, he was an—he was like an investment bro, you know, he—he made gazillions of dollars whenever he started working. Yeah. And I think some people, Bo and I probably could do that too because I mean I just—I’m in a high income type situation. I don’t know that everybody can replicate that. And that’s the thing I have is because when I create as a content creator, I’m always—I want to make sure when I’m giving guidance to people that I’m spreading the net out so far that I don’t give people false hope, but also give them enough optimism that this is—they can—this can be replicated thousands if not millions of times over and nobody’s disappointed. I worry—you were—you’ve just—this unicorn situation you’ve set yourself up with is that there’s way more demand. You get 200 emails, you say a day of people saying, “Hey, can you come do this interpretive signing here and there” and you’re like, “This is so great. I’ve got all this opportunity coming in.” You’re like, “But you know what? Even though I’m 33, by the way, if you think you’re burned out at 33, wait until you get to be 52.” I mean, because I just had this conversation with another one of my old business guys that we’re in the same field. He makes a great living. He’s like, “I just don’t want to do this anymore.” All my CPA buddies. Yeah, my bill rate is $500, $600 an hour. I don’t care. I don’t want to do it. So if you think at 33 you’re burned out, this is going to get worse. I’m just going to go ahead and tell you—it’s just the reality of life. It’s a—

Danielle: I think it’s a temporary burnout. Okay. I think I need—I needed this year to recover a little bit because I was doing so much work and saving so much from—you know—late 2020 all the way up until the end of 2024. So I think that’s what I feel like I just got a little bit burnt out.

Finding Middle Ground (23:03)

Bo: So you were—you were at red line. You were operating at maximum capacity.

Danielle: I’m not saying that’s going to continue—just that I needed a little break this year.

Bo: So far we’ve seen you operating in two realms. Maximum capacity or now—I mean if you do—you do $9,000 into $110,000—that’s an 8% savings rate. Going from killing the savings rate like 30%–40% right—to 8%—it seems just as a casual bystander—there might be some middle ground that might be—that might be more sustainable and more fruitful over the long term—that might give you more options and flexibility.

Brian: I want to bring them—because I like us to be—we’re nerds. We do the analytical stuff too—but I also try to do the Die with Zero stuff where I’m trying to tell you to make sure you—you maximize your 20s, your 30s. That’s why that’s part of the book we do love. Yeah. I mean that’s why—I mean that’s why in Millionaire Mission I talk about bedazzle your basic life. I don’t want people to be misers. I don’t want people to—but there is a balance and sometimes I worry that we pull the needle too far the other way when it’s kind of that Epicurean type—go seize the day. I’m like—but more than likely you’re going to live to be a ripe old age—you know. So you got to—you got to—you got to put a little ounce, you know, spoonful of sugar of deferred gratification to make sure that we’re going to have a life well-lived. And you can do that when you’re 33. What I worry is somebody reads Die with Zero and just assume forever they can, you know, they do some extrapolating like you did. Then they get to be 46 or 43 anytime and they realize, “Oh my gosh, the most powerful thing I have, which is compounding growth and the wealth multiplier.” I was wrong. I wish I would have kind of—yeah, I went too far into the Epicurean side of trying to maximize versus taking a spoonful or a little bit of deferred gratification to ensure that I—it was a life well-lived all the way through. Yeah. Now, if you can tell me you’re gonna make $400,000, $500,000 a year in your 40s and 50s, we can go—live the hog life. I mean, just go for it. I mean, but I don’t know that you can promise me that you can do that.

Danielle: No, I definitely can’t. I guess my one question, so—and this was kind of a big push for me to apply on the show because I started watching Making a Millionaire and you would say, okay, you’re going to end up with $2 million, that means you have $80,000 to spend. And I was like, “Oh, that’s really different than what I have.” But I thought the spreadsheet, so I’m using a spreadsheet that’s from a financial influencer, I guess—Money Flamingo. They’re over in Australia, but they read Die with Zero and they created this spreadsheet. So I thought that the dollar amounts were inflation adjusted. I think that’s what it says on the spreadsheet. So that I’m not actually going to end up—it’s $1.7 million of whatever that’s worth in—

Inflation and Returns Discussion (25:49)

Bo: Well it depends on the rate of return assumptions right—so if you’re using—if 7% was the rate that they used—I would guess most likely that that was a nominal rate of return meaning you would have to adjust for inflation. Now if that was an inflation-adjusted rate of return what they’re actually saying is that they believe inside your portfolio you can achieve a 10% rate of return—right—and they’re showing you a net of inflation 7%. I would argue especially for a young person—while I think there’s a real chance that you could earn 10%—I would not base my retirement well-being on that. I’d rather be much more conservative in my estimations. Okay. So that’s why we were just using the math. If you said seven, we’re going to apply a 3% inflation rate to bring it back to today’s. Does that make sense?

Danielle: Yeah. That—and that is a rate I picked. Okay. Yeah. I put in that information. I actually had it much more conservative at 5%. But then I was watching your show and you guys use 7.5% and maybe I misunderstood. Maybe that’s not inflation adjusted.

Bo: Well, that’s—if you were using 5%, right? Then you add a 3% inflation, that would be like an 8% rate of return. Now, we are kind of aligned, right? That is more in the ballpark. The fact of the matter is we also—we just don’t know what the market’s going to do. I mean, we—we have the historical of what the market’s done, but there are seasons where the market does not perform as well as other seasons, and you don’t get to control that necessarily. Now, fortunately, you are young, so you have a long enough timeline. Odds are the market’s going to do pretty good for you. But in the Die with Zero vein, if we told you, hey, in our opinion, 8% is not—is not the savings rate you ought to be shooting for now. It ought to be something higher. Are there life sacrifices that you would be making? Are there things that you would not be able to do that you’re able to do now that that would cause some friction? Because I want to make sure we’re being sensitive to that, right? Are you able to still enjoy your 30s and do the things you want to do even if you had maybe not the 40% savings rate, but some savings rate higher than 8%.

Danielle: I think so. I mean, I might have to not eat out as much or I don’t, you know, whatever the case may be. Maybe I can’t get that nice Airbnb, I have to do a little bit less or—but I don’t think it—I don’t think it would too much. I would rather play it safe. I’m a relatively risk-averse person, but—yeah, I was just kind of going by that spreadsheet. So at $1.7 million I was withdrawing $132,000 a year and that got me to the $300,000–$400,000.

The Math Behind the Plan (28:16)

Brian: And that’s what I wish if I had that data because I’m curious to know if that was already inflation adjusted or if that’s just in nominal dollars what it was at that point in time because then that brings it back because $132,000 brought back to inflation is a much less—things are just going to cost a lot more than they do today.

Bo: And help me understand the mathematics here, right? So you—let’s say you make $110,000, right? And you say you have a 36% hold back for taxes, right? So $110,000, we’re going to hold back 36%. That means we’re going to net about $70,000. So then you have a burn rate of $4,000, right? That’s what you showed us on your budget, $4,000 a month. So $70,000 minus a $4,000 monthly burn rate. So it’s going to be what? $48,000. We’re going to have $22,000 left over. Is my math maths on that, right? Yeah. In theory, that $22,000, this is after your living expenses and after your taxes. That would be what I would assume goes to savings, but you said you’re saving $9,000. So we have a pretty big delta. Yeah, that’s the—you’re thinking it’s going to go to cars. It might go to other goals. That’s what you’re thinking.

Danielle: Yeah. I also have $600 for cash to save every month as well. They’re pretty much all—I mean except—well an emergency fund I guess—a little bit of a sinking fund but yeah—I’d like to buy a house at some point and—I have a travel fund because when I don’t work I don’t get paid. So if I—this year I went to Croatia which is really fun for 9 or 10 days—I usually do a big trip like that every year and so I don’t get paid for a third of the month. So I do have a travel sinking fund to just help out during that time so I can kind of use that as income a little bit.

Financial Order of Operations (30:04)

Bo: This is one of the reasons why I love the Financial Order of Operations, right? Because it’s this nine-step process we put together to help us kind of figure out where to put our dollars. Yeah. When you think about this saving, you already said you got $600 going to cash. So let’s move away from that for a moment. The $750 that you’re investing on a monthly basis. So now walk us through how you’re doing that because we saw you have a Roth IRA, we saw you have a solo 401(k). How are you divvying out your dollars? Because I’m wondering if what I don’t know is—what’s the appropriate savings rate for you? Well, I wonder if just doing some of the Financial Order of Operations stuff would begin to answer that question for us. So walk us through on that $750, where does it go every month?

Danielle: Well, now that it’s down to $750, most of it goes just into the Roth IRA to max that out and then the rest of it goes into the Roth portion of my solo 401(k). And I will admit, I feel like I kind of—dance around the Financial Order of Operations. I think I go through them, you know, where I was probably at five. I was maxing out both of those. I mean, not fully because solo 401(k) you can set aside $69,000. I don’t make-

Bo: $72,000 in 2026.

Danielle: That’s true. I can’t do that. But, you know, now I’m kind of back to—oh, my emergency reserves. I have to go back to—you know—to number four and go back to that. And so I feel like I kind of dance around to the different steps. And I don’t know if that’s the best.

Bo: No, but that is the way it works. It’s bluish. Yeah. Okay. So you max out your Roth IRA. That’s $7,000. So then you have about $2,000 roughly going into your solo 401(k), going into the Roth portion of your solo 401(k). Yeah. And when I was—saving a lot more, it’s—60%—I think—savings, right? It was maxing out the Roth IRA, maxing out the employee Roth portion, salary deferral. Yeah. Which is the same limit as just a regular 401(k). And then anything extra, I would either put it into that profit sharing employer.

Brian: Wow. So you were doing over $2,500 a month.

The Personality Factor (32:05)

Brian: She said she was doing 60%. That’s what—you got to help me understand. We were at 60% savings rate. Now we’re at 8%. If we—I guess if we include the $600 to cash, we’re at like 15%. I did the math in my head. That could be wrong. 60% down to 15%. How’d you just—how’d you—is that your personality though? Are you just hot or cold?

Danielle: Maybe a little bit. I said, I think I just got a little—tired of it, you know, and I developed—a lot of anxiety around it. Am I not going to have enough, but am I also just not doing anything in my life?

Brian: But hyperfocus, is that a thing of yours? I mean, even to do what you do for a living, I got to think to watch YouTube videos and be—I could do this. I mean, there’s something there with your personality is that you’re either in love or hyper into something or you’re just not, right?

Danielle: Yeah. Yeah, I would say that. Especially my hobbies. I used to rock climb all the time and then I got introduced to pickleball and—I can’t have more than one—boxing.

Brian: I mean I’m seeing a trend here is that you’re kind of—and that’s what—what I would love to do is because it seems like investing became a hobby and that’s why you got up to 60%. But you’re like—oh my gosh—it doesn’t leave anything for life and I’m a miser. So what I would love is for at the end of the day today is that you leave knowing—you know what—there needs to be a base level. It’s more than 8%. But it doesn’t have to be hog wild 60% either. I want to leave some margin for life. And just know that about yourself. I mean, we all have—I was just out talking to Carter, who’s our third in command here, that one of the things as I’ve gotten older, I’ve realized some of the quirky things about my own personality is my blessing, but it’s also a curse. And that thing is, if you have hyperfocus, it’s a blessing is because you’re in this unique skill set that you wouldn’t be able to do if you’re just the typical person that walks down the street. But it can be the curse in the fact that you get distracted and go in a completely different place. And doing that at 33 with your savings and investing could be bad down the road if we don’t get the math right to make sure you’re saving to—to not have regrets later.

Life Circumstances and the Break (34:07)

Danielle: I agree. And I think too when I was really saving a lot—you know—I—I used to be engaged. Okay. And then I’m not. But so—you know—living together for quite a while which really brought down living expenses. And I did save up a lot of money to buy a house. Dave Ramsey is going to hate me. Bought a house—you know—a few months before we were supposed to get married and then—you know—so I lost a lot of money in that. So—I think—I think that’s a big part of the break too because that happened in beginning of 2024. Yeah. So I think that’s why I just got—I was just a little tired.

Brian: I get it. Doing it all. You’re trying to do a whole lot—achiever mentality—just throwing it all in there.

Danielle: And there was a big income disparity. So I was doing a lot of the heavy lifting—a lot of—yeah—that kind of stuff.

Tax Strategy Discussion (35:02)

Bo: So on this—you mentioned earlier that you have this 36% hold back for taxes. When you actually file your tax return every year, is all that 30%—are you actually paying 36% effective tax rate?

Danielle: This is the first year. So basically—my mom is my accountant in a way. She works under a CPA, so technically he looks over all the tax stuff before it’s submitted, but—every year it’s basically just been—my tax rate has increased. So when I started out it was 23%, COVID hit, I made $30,000 that year—it was a bad time to start a new career. And then it went up to 30% and then, you know, so this was the first year it was 36%. I think last year was 30% and I did owe more than I had, you know, I pay the quarterly estimated taxes and then usually I have some left over. So if I owe, I’ve already got that set aside. So I don’t feel like I’m actually spending my money. But last year I actually owed more than what I had—more than you had set aside. Yeah, kind of.

Brian: I mean, I’m looking at the tax tables right now, and this is 2025’s tax tables. As a single individual, you cross into the 22% bracket around $48,000. So that means—that’s why you can go a little less than that, but a lot of your income is subject to that marginal rate of 22%. What’s the state income tax where you live? Is it 5%–6%?

Danielle: I don’t know if I’m—

Brian: That’s why—I bet when you—when you add a state income tax to your marginal—when you bring it back—that 20%—that’s worth the 21%. And then Social Security and Medicare—the self-employment tax is 15.3%. I can see—you got good counsel. And I mean this is the hard part. I think when people realize what they pay in taxes and you—because most people don’t realize when you’re a W-2 employee—you get wages. Your employer is paying 7.65% on your behalf. Yeah. It’s this thing that nobody realizes. That’s why it doesn’t seem like that big of a deal. But your employer is paying. Yeah. Insurance and the matching—all of that.

Danielle: I don’t get—you know—I’m paying $440, I think, starting next year for my health insurance. And yeah, there’s no match. So all of that investment is just-

The Tax Saving Strategy (37:09)

Brian: Now, we just boo-hooed a little bit, but here’s the good news. Even with the boo-hooing of the 36% reserve rate, you’re going to—we’re going to show you—you got—you got this.

Bo: Well, and I was even going to a different place hearing—and this is true for a lot of single filers and especially entrepreneurs. One of the single best ways to offer some reprieve on your tax return is to do that via a qualified retirement plan. So I love hearing that you have a solo 401(k) that you’re taking advantage of, but you’re doing the Roth portion of the solo 401(k) and we love Roth. We think Roth is amazing, but with you being in that tax situation, it might be an interesting thing to ask either your mom or the person overseeing the taxes, hey, what if I shifted my Roth contribution, my Roth solo to pre-tax? And in doing that, does that actually create a mechanism for me to save more money? Yeah. If you just think about 2026, it’s going to go to $24,500 that you can salary deferral into a solo 401(k). And how many—what we think—we’re going to call it? 30% is your marginal tax rate once you do all-in. That would save you $7,300 in taxes. So walk me through this. If you could just max out your solo, you will save enough in taxes that you could then fund your Roth IRA. Okay. Well, in just doing those two things, you just saved $31,500 a year. Now, I’m not suggesting that’s where it needs to be, but I am wondering, are you even saving in the most efficient way for the strategy that you’re trying to implement?

Danielle: Yeah, because that seems more like I don’t really even have to do anything except click a different button in order to do that because my solo 401(k) for the—salary deferral I can do both Roth and traditional—I get to pick—and then for the profit sharing, it’s always going to be pre-tax but I-

Bo: I think that if you’re able to fund, max out the Roth IRA which you are, you may be reaching that threshold. This is hard for a lot of young people where Roth 401(k) might not make the most sense. Pre-tax may be the one that makes the most sense. And by shifting that, you decrease what you’re paying to the taxes, you increase what you’re actually saving, you increase what you get to keep in your back pocket.

Danielle: Yeah. I thought the financial advice that was common was once you get to the 24% bracket is when you do more traditional. And if you’re below that, then you focus on the Roth. So I was kind of—

Brian: Well, it depends on what…I don’t have a phone in front—I do that on purpose so I don’t get distracted. But I think there’s a state income tax in Maryland, isn’t it?

Danielle: There definitely is.

Brian: There is. So that’s what your marginal rate if you add those two. If you add your state and your federal, you’re probably getting close to 30% right there. And that’s—

Danielle: There’s the county tax there too on top of—see there’s another. So there’s a lot of this. Yeah. And I’m in—I’m in city limits. So it’s probably more than 2 minutes down the road is literally the county.

Bo: So you have to make a—okay. If your goal is, hey, I want to do this coast thing—I have these two options. I can either pay myself money and build my coffers or I can pay it to the government through taxes. Yeah. I would imagine you’d rather pay yourself and do that. So that even might be a mechanism because I just—an interest-free loan to the government. Right. Right.

Finding the Right Savings Rate (40:16)

Bo You’re at 8% savings or—I don’t—you were one of those people we talk about all the time. If you go to moneyguy.com/resources, we have—this deliverable said how much should you save—and we—we talk about 25%—25% or 20%—you may very well be one of those cases where 25% may not be the right number for you—right—that may not be what’s required—but it might be 15%—or at least to give yourself options so that you can reach that tipping point—so you can reach that boiling point—so you can reach that time where then it actually does make sense to take your foot off the gas. Yeah. I just think you’ve done it, my opinion, a little prematurely.

Bo: Too early. That’s right. Yeah. Yeah, I would agree with that.

Brian: Well, let me—let me put some—some color with this is that—it’s back to the whole mindset issue. You told us—was it 2021? You’ve done all of this since maybe late 2020. Yeah. So you went pretty crazy in a good way. In a good way. In a good way. But now there was probably some scars from that. I’m just—for sure. I mean because you’ve already shared with us some of the struggles from that. What I’m just trying to make sure is that we’re closing out when we record this. You know, you’re only four years into this journey of saving and investing. Yeah. To say—and it’s back to Bo’s analogy of a marathon runner. If you sprinted, you know, on a 26.2 marathon and you sprinted like it was a 100-yard dash. Yeah. It makes sense that you’re burned out and you’re over there holding your side going—maybe it was—I just didn’t eat enough bananas. No, you ran—you just ran wide open for the first—you know—you acted like this was a 100-yard dash versus 26.2 miles. I still say with you only doing this for four years on a—on a—on a 30-to-40-year journey of building these assets so they can be an army of dollar bills to work for you. You—you’re closer to the front line to the—to the starting point than you are to midpoint to the ending. That’s where I get worried from a mentality standpoint when people tell me they’re coasting four years—because we—we have financial mutants all the time that are in their 20s making a great living—crushing it because they had a great living and they—they’re still in—they should be in the make wealth phase. Yeah. You got to get to exactly what Bo said. We call it the boiling point, the tipping point, whatever—you can do to where now the assets. That’s why we have the people say, “Why did you even come up with this Know Your Number course?” We did the Know Your Number course so you know if you’re ahead of the curve, behind the curve, or right where you’re supposed to be. You tried to do that with this spreadsheet. We’d have to—after the show we’ll figure that out. But it is one of those things where I think you’re so close to the starting line. I don’t know that—I think you’re ahead of the curve yet. You are in this moment in time because we want you to have one times your income by age 30. Here you are at 33 with—you’re well beyond one times. But does that mean you get to now take your foot off the gas? You need to be doing more than 8%. Yeah.

Danielle: A little bit because I was—pedal all the way down. Nowhere else—

Bo: I don’t think you’re running the 100-yard dash going 20 miles an hour. Yeah. I don’t think you started walking, right? And you’re at the place where you don’t have to sprint anymore because of the hard work you did for the last four or five years. Yeah. But also walking probably would not serve you well. And so what I’m excited is that we’re going to—we’re going to be able to show you, hey, here’s what it looks like if maybe you change that a little bit. Hey, what if instead of doing this, we did this and what are the outcomes? And what you do is the earlier you make those decisions, especially when you’re young, the more flexibility you give yourself to really get to make fun decisions in the future. Because you may decide at 40, hey, I want to work two days a week or I want to take six months off or I want to—whatever that thing is. And we’d rather you have more margin in the system to be able to do that than—uh oh, I was a little too aggressive in my assumptions.

Understanding the Goals (44:00)

Brian: What I want to know, Bo, is—so we can make sure that we share with Danielle some of our thoughts—because you and I are going to huddle up on this. Do we have enough assumptions about what her dream expenses are for the future, what we currently have so that we can kind of do some research on our own?

Bo: Yeah. The only thing that—that’s not incredibly clear to me that I’d like to have a better beat on to be able to really crank through some numbers. You said that right now, hey, my living expenses right now are about $4,000. And at $4,000, I can do the things I want, the way I want, when I want. But one day I’m not going to be working 5 days a week. Even when I’m working 4 days a week, I’m going to have one extra day that I’m able to go do something. And I wonder if that something might actually involve consumption, right?

Danielle: I mean it’s probably pickleball.

Bo: Right. So you—we got to get the really good paddles and we got to get the—so my question for you would be—when we think about the—and this is another really hard thing to project when you’re 33 years old. When you think about in that time where I’m either working less or not working at all, what would it cost in today’s dollars for me to live the life that I want to live? That means go on travel and be able to replace the car and be able to play pickleball and be able to eat out and be able to—all those things. Because I guess it would be more than $4,000. But you have to tell me—maybe $4,000 satisfies all that. What is that number for you to be able to really live the life that you want to live?

Danielle: I guess I’m assuming this is in today’s dollars. Okay. Because I think I’m of the mindset that I’d rather do a lot of the traveling and stuff now. And I probably won’t do that as much in retirement. Okay. Because I already have terrible knees. I can’t imagine when I’m 60 what they’re going to be like. So—I don’t—I don’t think I’m going to be doing anything super luxurious. But I don’t know. I guess if I didn’t have to—say—because I guess you get to the point where you’re not investing anymore. So when you retire, you stop investing, right? You go from an accumulator to a decumulator—and maybe just cash for—you know—cars and the house, the AC breaks, whatever. So—I would probably say my current income right now—if I didn’t have to set aside as much money for investing, I think—you know—whatever that is in future dollars—$110,000. Yeah.

Bo: So $110,000 minus your—minus your tax burn, right? Because tax will still be an issue. So I had you like $70,000 would be your net of tax number that’s coming in. Yeah. Is that the magic number? Hey, if I had that coming in, I don’t have to think about saving. I cover the taxes. $70,000 a year. About $5,800.

Danielle: I definitely think that—that would be all right. So now we have a target. Now we have a target to shoot for. And I do hope at some point I’ll—I’ll be a dual income, you know, I would like to get married at some point.

Variables and Flexibility (46:46)

Bo: Another reason why there are so many variables that can change between now and the time that you get to 37 and between the time you get to 60 and then by the time you’ve already told us you’re going to die at 90. By the time you die at 90—that could change the circumstances. So all you can control right now is your behavior. And so we’d rather you do is while you can—whatever cliche you want—strike while the iron is hot or take it—whatever—do that now. So that way as some of these other variables do change, you’ll be in an even better position to make that adjustment and to make that switch.

Brian: And when we figure out, it’s not going to be 60%, it’s going to be more than 8%. But whatever the number percentage we find out, what I like and what gets me excited is it leaves enough margin for you still to live a life because I think that’s the problem. You made this into an all-in, you know, you had two speeds, wide open and then snail’s pace. Yeah. And that’s what—there’s—there’s so much before there that we could—we could get you in a healthy place, but then it gives you the freedom to say—unlock and say, I’m going to automatically—make it automatic for the people, set it, forget it, and then after that, I can go enjoy my life and—and do the Die with Zero thing. So I feel like I’m getting the mindset of enjoying the moment—without sacrificing what the wealth multiplier and compound growth can do for you. Yeah.

Bo: Hey, this has been great. I’m excited. You’re going to be in a great spot. And—I’m excited we can do a little bit of—a little bit of number crunching. Yeah. And show you how there might be a better way. Yeah. To do money for you. Okay.

The Analysis and Results (48:13)

Bo: Brian, how awesome was Danielle? I think she holds a special place in my heart because I feel like the conversation we had with her is the same conversation I’ve had with a number of my friends over the years.

Brian: Bo what’s wild about Danielle is that she had—it’s like she had two gears. It was like she’s—wide open—saving over 50% of her income to now she’s like, “Hey, it’s got to do something different.” To the point she’s bringing it all the way down to 8%. And that breaks my heart because I feel like there has to be an in-between is noble what she wants to do, but I’m worried she’s gone too far the other way.

Bo: Well, and remember this was her mindset. Hey, I want to do this and I want to—I’m taking my foot off the gas and I want to take my foot even further off the gas. And so we said, “Okay, let’s figure out what that actually looks like for her.” And remember—her—she said her goal in financial independence was to be able to spend $6,000 a month in today’s dollars. And she wanted to operate under this sort of Coast FIRE mentality. I’m going to save now and then at 37 I’m going to back it down. So we said, “Okay, we need $6,000 a month per month in retirement. We’re going to assume a 3% annual inflation, 3% annual salary increase, and we’re just going to use her current pay of right at about $120,000 a year.” And we said, “Okay, let’s assume because she is young, she can earn 8.7% annualized.” And we know that she already has $165,000. So we said, “All right, let’s problem solve for her right now. If she’s backing down her savings, what does it need to be from now until 37—from 37 on—to be able to reach financial independence?”

The 15% Solution (49:40)

Brian: I remember, you know, when you and I started brainstorming this on where the solution was. We’re like, okay, 8% seems like she’s gone way too far with it, but—so let’s do something a little—you know—we always talk about 25%. Maybe a good in-between starting place was 15%.

Bo: Well, and this is what we found. If she just saves 15% from now until 37, when she gets to 37, she’ll have about $326,000 saved up. Then if she were to reduce that—she was going to take her foot off the gas—how much would she have to—stay save to still be able to reach financial independence? The number was 12.5%.

Brian: Yeah, that doesn’t seem as exciting to me. Now look, we’re solving to try to get to—because it looks like we need to get her as close to $4 million as possible. And I like where our mindset was with this 15%. But nobody—when we tell her, hey, guess what? Congratulations. You get to lower—once you get to this point. Instead of doing 15%, we’re going to let you do 12.5%. It’s going to be a whoop.

Bo: But rather what we tell folks, and we say this all the time, is hey, we want you saving 25%. The reason we tell people that is if you can do it early and often, you give yourself flexibility. You give yourself freedom in the future. And Danielle’s no different. Now, she was saving some crazy number like 60%. We said, “Look, I don’t think that’s necessary, but what does it look like if you actually follow the Money Guy rules? What’s it look like if you do save 25% of your gross income just for a little longer? Just for a little—let’s not—let’s not pick 37. Let’s say—what does it look like if you can save 25% from right now at age 33 out until 40. That doesn’t seem that tough. I think we can do it and it ties into our rules. It’s very financial mutant-esque. And so this is what we found. If she can do that, just save 25% from now until 40, she’s able to turn $165,000 into $624,000. Now we’re getting some money.

The Coast FIRE Sweet Spot (51:28)

Bo: Okay, so we’re at $624,000 by 40 and our goal is to get to around $4 million. How much could she then take her foot off the gas? How much could she back off if she did it then? It’s wild that she could reduce her savings rate to 4.6%. That is coast FIRE. Let’s go get a reaction. It’s not exactly coast FIRE, but it’s close to coast FIRE. I think that’s what she’s looking for. She was just trying to do it way too early. She was trying to pull her foot off the gas before she had actually reached the critical mass, reached the boiling point, reached the place where her dollars could actually work.

Brian: And I know, you know, I envision Danielle seeing this information and saying, “Okay, I can stretch—do a stretch goal of 25%, that’s half of what I was doing when I was doing crazy—beyond 50%.” But then we get to tell her she gets to save less than 5% the rest of the way. That seems like coasting to me.

Bo: And I think—and what’s great is we even told her because she was a self-employed individual, said, “Hey, we even think that there are some ways that you could think about how you’re saving. Maybe doing the Roth solo 401(k) doesn’t make sense. Maybe you should do the pre-tax solo 401(k) and maybe you should really follow the Financial Order of Operations.” What I think is beautiful is if she were to do that and we just assume that she follows the FOO to a tee—when she gets to financial independence—when she gets out to age 60—and we actually look at her three tax buckets. You can see that just by doing it that way—she’ll have about $1.3 million in tax-deferred assets, right? $2.3 million in tax-free assets and another $340,000 in after-tax. She will then at that point be able to pick and choose what her tax rate is because she saved and built in a super efficient manner.

Addressing Die with Zero (53:06)

Brian: I love how this is all laid out. Now, I want to play devil’s advocate and try to pick this thing apart a little bit because she talked about Die with Zero a number of times and so she might be willing to say, “Hey, this is great, but remember I’m not trying to leave a legacy. I’m not trying to leave a lot of money.” What do you say about that?

Bo: Well, what I would tell her is this assumes that you work all the way till 60. You wait till 60 for financial independence. And this is assuming a 4% withdrawal rate. In reality, if she can save at this clip and she can build the assets early on, what’s most likely going to happen is she’s going to give herself freedom and flexibility to potentially decide on a more quick time frame. Maybe I want to be financially independent at 58, 55, 53. I don’t know what the number is. She’ll be able to define that. But only if she does the hard work now to set her future self up to make that decision.

Brian: Well, I also think—you know—the problem with tell me you don’t want to leave a legacy. You have to tell me what day you plan on dying—when you check out. That’s the thing is you still have to get to some level of critical mass so that just in case you live to a ripe old age—that this thing doesn’t completely fall apart around you.

Bo: She has all the tools. She has everything necessary to be successful. But I think she does need to adjust the mindset. I think she went through some life stuff. She was a little burned out, but if she can kind of recalibrate, re-enter, redefine what her goals are, I think she’s going to be in a great place to still be able to control her entire financial future.

Homework Assignments (54:23)

Brian: So let’s go ahead and kind of recapping. What homework would you give to Danielle so she can go ahead and start working on this order and this plan tomorrow?

Bo: Number one, I said she needs to beef up her emergency fund. She has $10,000 in reserves right now, but we said based on her living expenses, she should probably be closer to $18,000 to $24,000. Okay. We also said she probably ought to consider increasing her savings rate. Our recommendation—instead of 8% right now, I don’t know what she was thinking. We would rather her go to 25%. If she can do that, she’s going to give her 40-year-old self a lot of flexibility, a lot of options. We also said inside of a 401(k), she may want to shift from doing Roth contributions to pre-tax contributions because being a self-employed individual, she does have a more cumbersome tax scenario. So switching to pre-tax would likely free up cash flow and allow her to have additional savings—if she—so she could do those Roth contributions. If she could do the pre-tax solo, then she could then fund her Roth. She’s going to be able to build her three distinct tax buckets and control her financial—

Brian: I know this is going to have her saving a little longer than she initially planned, but when we show—I wish I could see her face when we say, “Hey, look, you just do this for a little bit longer at this reasonable level and now you can coast—only saving less than 5%.” I think she’s going to be pretty excited.

Bo: I think she—again—she has all the tools, all the ability to be able to do it. I think that she has a beautiful financial future if she can make some of these decisions today.

Closing (55:46)

Brian: Danielle, thank you for coming on the show. We had an absolute blast creating this type of content with you and I see so much opportunity. Go on this journey, please. 25%—just a little bit longer. Hold on just a little bit longer and awesome stuff is coming your way. If you would like to be a guest on Making a Millionaire, you can go to moneyguy.com/apply. Or if you want to check out any of our free resources, go to moneyguy.com/resources. I’m your host Brian joined by Mr. Bo. Money Guy team out.